Chat History with basekamp/$bc2fa6813d536450" title="#basekamp/$bc2fa6813d536450">A School of Decreative Methodologies (#basekamp/$bc2fa6813d536450)

Created on 2010-02-23 21:16:55.

2010-02-23

Jessica Westbrook: 17:54:10

hi all

stephen wright: 17:54:40

Hello everyone

BASEKAMP team: 17:54:52

Hi Stephen

BASEKAMP team: 17:54:56

Hi everyone

Elysa Lozano: 17:55:01

hello!

magdalenatc: 17:55:14

hi there

BASEKAMP team: 17:57:11

We'll be starting in a few moments

BASEKAMP team: 18:01:56

hey Katherine, you said text only is fine - jsut making sure You don't wish to listen in to the audio?

BASEKAMP team: 18:02:05

who would like to join the audio?

mabel: 18:02:11

me

Jessica Westbrook: 18:02:19

audio in tennessee please

Jessica Westbrook: 18:02:27

teleseed this week

magdalenatc: 18:02:32

yes, audio here please

Elysa Lozano: 18:02:51

me too

katherinecarl: 18:03:17

ah yes I should listen, thx

BASEKAMP team: 18:03:49

ok, we'l be starting the call in a moment. If anyone feels like typing in things that are beign discussed, we won't complain

BASEKAMP team: 18:04:06

...for those who can't get on audio

katherinecarl: 18:04:10

great that's helpful

BASEKAMP team: 18:10:59

Nick, did you want to join the chat?

magdalenatc: 18:11:02

can hear you well. thank you.

BASEKAMP team: 18:11:24

i'l mute our audio for the moment, untill one of us has someting to ask or add

BASEKAMP team: 18:15:15

Eric, if you can mte yur audio until you want to chim in , that'd be great

BASEKAMP team: 18:15:21

maybe even lower your volume at that time

BASEKAMP team: 18:15:24

thanks

BASEKAMP team: 18:16:26

http://basekamp.com/about/events/school-decreative-methodologies

stephen wright: 18:16:59

A collegial moment without students, without teachers, without walls, without curricula, in rupture with all notions that institute art and how it is taught. The initiative accompanies forms of usership disposed to sundering art from itself.



   1. The college’s goal is to activate practices whose purpose and finality is not art.

   2. It asserts its institutional exodus.

   3. It deploys and takes form through satellite propositions, which are at once extradisciplinary and depersonalized.

   4. It functions on the basis of users alone, impugning any binary opposition between teachers / students, experts / non-experts.

   5. It operates through networks with or without affinities.

Jessica Westbrook: 18:17:31

hi

magdalenatc: 18:17:33

i am in UK

Jessica Westbrook: 18:17:35

tennesseeeeee

mabel: 18:17:38

paris

katherinecarl: 18:17:44

what city in TN?

Jessica Westbrook: 18:17:52

chattanooga

Jessica Westbrook: 18:18:03

2 hours north of atl, on east side of tenn

BASEKAMP team: 18:20:57

Stephen, is the idea similar to NSK's "State in time"?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:23:09

I think the audio has gone

Jessica Westbrook: 18:23:37

audio is good here

magdalenatc: 18:25:34

can you say a bit more about 'what' it is that you activate?

katherinecarl: 18:26:33

are there certain types of knowledge or ways at getting at knowledge that you are most interested in?

BASEKAMP team: 18:27:52

^^ it sounds like "getting at" might be gotten to differently through the type of usership stephen's mentioning - maybe co-producing, or another form of discovery?

stephen wright: 18:28:41

Here is a description of Eric Collegial Moment:

stephen wright: 18:28:42

We propose collegial moments between citizens for whom criminal practices are routine and familiar.  These groups of 6 to 12 people (who may be non-criminals, criminals, or ex-criminals), will embark on a process of identifying the ruses, tricks, skills, and insights that each user has developed while inhabiting, visiting, and/or creating/working in a criminalized context.  Users will be conceive of new ways to apply these specialized capacities to new ends, far afield from their initial contexts.

BASEKAMP team: 18:30:42

Is what Eric's discussing part of a project that we can find out more about? Or is this "collegial moment" something that's only understood in the context of the college?

stephen wright: 18:30:43

Here is a description of the collegial moment I have proposed;

stephen wright: 18:30:48

Open Labyrinth names the paradoxical condition of an art lost in an open field, the very openness of which prevents recognition of the loss. Art finds itself in the throes of an unprecedented ontological crisis – having lost its self-definition and its self-evident modalities of appearing in the world – while the critical lexicon inherited from the twentieth century is ill equipped to describe art-related practices indifferent to current convention. Conceived as a testing ground for developing a revamped critical terminology, each meeting draws on the presence of a guest researcher’s work on a particular term likely to usefully renew our conceptual vocabulary.

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:32:08

sounds really fantastic

stephen wright: 18:32:50

the creative processes of crime!

Jessica Westbrook: 18:33:40

magdalenatc: 18:33:41

sounds really great

BASEKAMP team: 18:34:23

Eric, it's be interesting to hear what you think about Temporary Services project "prisoners inventions": http://basekamp.com/about/projects/prisoners-inventions

stephen wright: 18:34:30

CM proposed by Bob the Builder

BASEKAMP team: 18:34:31

...no rush, but at some point

stephen wright: 18:34:32

Au travail / At work is a collective open to all wage labourers misusing their workplace as a site for residency, repurposing the means of production, resources or information. Through examining a number of documented cases of misuse, users will be encouraged to further broaden the scope of the collective in their own line of work.

magdalenatc: 18:35:34

i have a question to eric: do you have an idea of those new ends to which to apply those new ways? or actually do you imagine the ways in which that might go?

BASEKAMP team: 18:37:41

do you also see criminality in craetive processes?

BASEKAMP team: 18:37:51

^^ to eric

BASEKAMP team: 18:38:22

Stephen, side-note: is the former paris biennial collége website still up somewhere?

stephen wright: 18:38:46

Here is one of the most active collegial moments, instigated by Jean Baptiste Farkas, called "The Lessons of Subtraction", basically on downsizing in art and elsewhere.

magdalenatc: 18:38:47

sure.

stephen wright: 18:38:48

The world is a tremendous plethora.  We must begin to subtract as a form of productive activity.

katherinecarl: 18:38:50

the play on creative and productive is very interesting. Are you concerned with "output" of these knowledges or not necessarily? is it wholly process-based?

magdalenatc: 18:39:03

yes, thank you. eric

BASEKAMP team: 18:39:05

the au travail website is down

Jessica Westbrook: 18:40:16

hi greg!

mabel: 18:40:16

we are working on the site internet of the college

Greg Scranton: 18:40:26

hi jessica

stephen wright: 18:41:09

A CM proposed by Gina Badger

stephen wright: 18:41:11

Ecological Erotics of Learning is a study group that takes for granted that all learning comes from desire, which brings us in short order into relations with other begins, human and non-. More succinctly, learning creates ecologies. Users will begin with analysis and discussion of key texts on radical ecology,  marginal education, and the pedagogical turn in contemporary art, geared towards imagining a pedagogy of decreative methodologies.

BASEKAMP team: 18:42:16

mabel, i was just curious - it makes sense that the website should change now that the school has become autonomized

mabel: 18:43:30

yes, you are right

BASEKAMP team: 18:43:57

                                                                                       

mabel: 18:44:09

Greg Scranton: 18:44:14

scott, have you started audio?

BASEKAMP team: 18:45:34

please let me know if anyone still needs to b added 2 the audio

BASEKAMP team: 18:45:44

De- symposium

Nick Hanford: 18:46:00

can i be added to the audio?

katherinecarl: 18:46:07

can I be added too?

BASEKAMP team: 18:46:18

yessssssssssssssss

siu king chung: 18:46:38

Also King from CMP

BASEKAMP team: 18:47:01

   

Nick Hanford: 18:47:09

thank you

BASEKAMP team: 18:47:16

np!

BASEKAMP team: 18:47:27

we may not realize people have been booted off the audio

BASEKAMP team: 18:47:41

everyone please mute your audio when not chiming in.... -- thanks    

BASEKAMP team: 18:48:02

squaring the circle

BASEKAMP team: 18:48:55

hi randall!

Randall Szott: 18:49:02

hello

Randall Szott: 18:49:06

sorry i'm late

BASEKAMP team: 18:49:08

can you put your skype status to "Online"?

mabel: 18:49:25

I agree

BASEKAMP team: 18:49:38

adding you to the conference randall

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:49:45

are you talking about removing institutional language in order to arrive at a position to determine the space to function within the cultural sphere?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:50:35

in terms of a radical practice suggested by Deleuze and Nietzsche?

anthony sawrey: 18:51:59

if you are serious about taging it without getting into these quandries about 'names'...then give it a serial number ie: 2010/02

Jessica Westbrook: 18:52:30

nice anthony

Randall Szott: 18:52:59

oh audio fail

anthony sawrey: 18:53:00

seriously this debate sounds like some college kids sitting around trying to come up wiht band names. make the title the LEAST important of your tasks.

anthony sawrey: 18:53:28

audio fail here. in freefall.. trying to level out

BASEKAMP team: 18:53:33

Randall Szott: 18:53:35

its back

BASEKAMP team: 18:54:01

anthony adding you again

BASEKAMP team: 18:54:05

anyone else get dropped?

anthony sawrey: 18:54:05

tanks

BASEKAMP team: 18:54:11

np

Randall Szott: 18:55:15

hey stephen - can you say a bit about the relationship between decreation and slacking (you knew i had to ask)

BASEKAMP team: 18:55:27

Slacktivism!

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:55:33

your beginning to sound like kraftwerk

Randall Szott: 18:55:33

audio fail again

magdalenatc: 18:55:46

can't hear you, only weird sound.... should be recording it. it is quite in keeping with the de- side of things

bojana romic: 18:55:54

I got call dropped

BASEKAMP team: 18:56:18

magda, bojana, randall -- re-added you

Amanda Hills: 18:56:22

i've been cut off too

mabel: 18:56:28

me too

bojana romic: 18:56:32

works again - thanks

BASEKAMP team: 18:56:42

amanda & mabel - callign again

BASEKAMP team: 18:56:45

word

mabel: 18:56:56

great

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:57:20

maybe your talking about a new history of art or the second history of art - in terms of nietzsche and deleuze suggestion of dividing history in two!

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:57:34

sounds like rats in the system

magdalenatc: 18:57:37

is anyone saying anything? is it only me with the silence ON... oh i can hear you

Jessica Westbrook: 18:57:44

no sound here

mabel: 18:57:54

it's working now

magdalenatc: 18:58:04

i know what you mean, stephen <ss type="smile"></ss>

BASEKAMP team: 18:58:11

jwestbroo - adding uagain

BASEKAMP team: 18:58:31

David G - that sounds rather avant-guardy, doesn't it?

BASEKAMP team: 18:59:14

respnding to your questions about a post- or 2nd hisory. Stephen, is this something that soem of yoru colleagues are into?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:59:27

possibly

Randall Szott: 18:59:34

aaargh

Randall Szott: 18:59:38

very buggy tonight

BASEKAMP team: 18:59:44

Drooooooopppppppppp

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:59:51

reading to much klassowski & deleuze

magdalenatc: 18:59:51

very very

Randall Szott: 18:59:55

lost audio again

bojana romic: 18:59:55

call dropped again - sorry!

BASEKAMP team: 18:59:59

calling everyone back

stephen wright: 19:00:00

I think I got cut off too

Amanda Hills: 19:00:01

dropped again

Jessica Westbrook: 19:00:01

yep

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:00:03

sound off

mabel: 19:00:07

yes

stephen wright: 19:00:39

scott can you give me a call back?

magdalenatc: 19:00:44

and me

Randall Szott: 19:00:47

and me

Elysa Lozano: 19:00:53

yep

bojana romic: 19:01:02

and me

siu king chung: 19:01:14

also me

Amanda Hills: 19:01:21

sigh

BASEKAMP team: 19:01:27

everyone still there?

anthony sawrey: 19:01:38

add me again...BTW hi jessica.. you are under a pseudonym i see

stephen wright: 19:01:45

text only for me

Jessica Westbrook: 19:01:51

ya

Jessica Westbrook: 19:01:55

its old

magdalenatc: 19:02:01

yes,

BASEKAMP team: 19:02:05

calling EVEERYONE back. This time it was our internet. One channel failed. Moving to channel 2

Nick Hanford: 19:02:05

yep

Jessica Westbrook: 19:02:22

no worries

anthony sawrey: 19:02:38

hokkay

bojana romic: 19:02:41

thanks

Randall Szott: 19:03:06

dropped again

Jessica Westbrook: 19:03:06

we are talking slackers...

BASEKAMP team: 19:03:13

haha

Randall Szott: 19:03:16

i am a talking slacker

BASEKAMP team: 19:03:19

stop downloading porn everyone

Jessica Westbrook: 19:03:23

ha!

Amanda Hills: 19:03:23

the disconnection of decreation

bojana romic: 19:03:35

oups...fail again

BASEKAMP team: 19:03:39

BASEKAMP team: 19:03:41

 trying again

Jessica Westbrook: 19:03:42

everyone in this room denied the label

Randall Szott: 19:04:50

cultural production - did you know you can now get an MA in this stephen?

Randall Szott: 19:04:50

at Brandeis?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:04:54

yes its old since nietzsche suggested it in 1889, but then discussed by klossowski in the 1970's, but it also appears to provide the back bone of deleuze's project

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:05:13

i dont have audio

stephen wright: 19:05:21

I didn't know that, Randall, but II'm not surprised

stephen wright: 19:05:26

it was inevitable

Randall Szott: 19:05:31

the term gives me hives

stephen wright: 19:05:37

"creative" writing

Randall Szott: 19:05:50

ah yes

Randall Szott: 19:06:09

no one has audio yet do they?

stephen wright: 19:06:12

should we do text only then?

Randall Szott: 19:06:12

ok

stephen wright: 19:06:15

no

bojana romic: 19:06:18

no...

Randall Szott: 19:06:38

fine by me - if we're reaching consensus - ha

BASEKAMP team: 19:06:42

unfortunately our skype is getting surges i think

Jessica Westbrook: 19:06:51

cultural production : (

anthony sawrey: 19:06:53

here again....

BASEKAMP team: 19:08:10

Guys, were giong to try audio one more time -then if that doesn' t work we shoudl go test-only

BASEKAMP team: 19:08:19

so we don't get demoralized by this process

stephen wright: 19:08:23

Man, this is not good

Randall Szott: 19:08:24

http://www.brandeis.edu/programs/culturalproduction/

anthony sawrey: 19:08:50

oke

Randall Szott: 19:09:00

only hearing typing clearly

stephen wright: 19:09:11

don't know why this is so bad, but...

BASEKAMP team: 19:09:12

and there it is

BASEKAMP team: 19:09:21

Text only -- not sure what's up in skype-land tonight

Randall Szott: 19:09:35

dropped again - text ahead?

BASEKAMP team: 19:09:36

So... can we pick bck up where we left off?

Randall Szott: 19:09:40

hey sean!

Jessica Westbrook: 19:10:00

we are talking about cultural production

BASEKAMP team: 19:10:01

oops - wil ask Sean to upgrade

stephen wright: 19:10:01

Let's do it this way

mabel: 19:10:06

yes

BASEKAMP team: 19:10:10

ok --- so . where were we?

stephen wright: 19:10:19

 And we want to be talking about decreation!

eandockray" title="seandockray">Sean Dockray: 19:10:28

ha

eandockray" title="seandockray">Sean Dockray: 19:10:35

are you on audio?

stephen wright: 19:10:37

No

stephen wright: 19:10:41

seems not

eandockray" title="seandockray">Sean Dockray: 19:11:06

i can upgrade or whatever if you want me to... didnt know i had slippeed

anthony sawrey: 19:11:06

no audio. give it a try agian when you have a mo

BASEKAMP team: 19:11:11

chuckles

BASEKAMP team: 19:11:27

we're going to forego audio altogether, for anyone who didn't get that

Randall Szott: 19:11:37

so stephen was riffing on the relationship of slacking to decreation

anthony sawrey: 19:11:39

what do i have soup on my tie?

BASEKAMP team: 19:11:48

heh

Randall Szott: 19:12:07

and wa delving into the trickiness of escaping "productivist" language/thinking

stephen wright: 19:12:21

In the sense that slack is to work as the decreative is to creativity

ariane.d.: 19:12:40

what does slacking to decreation means stephen?

stephen wright: 19:12:41

slack "decreates" productivism

stephen wright: 19:13:20

it both undoes it and reveals it for what it is

anthony sawrey: 19:13:44

strangification is another description of the activity

BASEKAMP team: 19:13:46

so Stephen, there was a question here about the status of the school ... a few Qs actually

stephen wright: 19:14:00

It's not only strangification

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:14:10

i think you also mentioned desire or the drives

stephen wright: 19:14:11

That's a Brechtian / Russian formalist method

stephen wright: 19:14:29

the "status"?

BASEKAMP team: 19:14:39

* are you meeting on a regular basis?

* are there more than a handful of people involved, and

* either way, can other people get involved as users? if so what's the process?

BASEKAMP team: 19:15:22

did the "usership" carry over from the paris bienale, which i understand has a pretty high level of visibility?

stephen wright: 19:15:28

well, starting with the last, there is no "process" per se, but like most forms of usership, it is not something that one has to ask permission to do, nor is there any "right" way to do it

stephen wright: 19:16:02

for now, the overall usership is limited for sure

mabel: 19:16:23

actually the status is up to now instable or instatus

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:16:42

?

stephen wright: 19:17:05

an unstable status, you mean?

mabel: 19:17:10

which means at the same time that we try to resist to different fomrs

mabel: 19:17:22

and identity

mabel: 19:17:23

of institutionalisation

mabel: 19:17:51

and that the ways of operation and activation

mabel: 19:17:51

changes

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:17:51

how does that differ from what I have just said?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:18:29

concerning Nietzsche, Klossowski and Deleuze?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:19:02

in terms of removing instituitonalised langauge

mabel: 19:19:08

ah yes

mabel: 19:19:11

ok

stephen wright: 19:20:03

in my opinion, it is not so much about "removing" the language as in working to bring about a lexical shift to focus on what has already changed

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:20:22

but what you have discussed so far stephen is really fantastic

mabel: 19:20:23

yes, exactly

ariane.d.: 19:20:39

an other way to manipulate the language

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:20:41

ok just need to think about that a bit more

stephen wright: 19:20:50

meaning has been instituted, we don't want to remove it but rather minutely, yet decisevly shift it

stephen wright: 19:21:01

no, it's not about manipulation

stephen wright: 19:21:20

no one owns the monopoly on these definitions of things like... art... school... etc

mabel: 19:21:55

it's more about re-configuration than manipulation

ariane.d.: 19:22:04

of course

stephen wright: 19:22:10

I think, by and large, we see lanugage through a usership prism -- the use we make of it

ariane.d.: 19:22:36

reagencement

stephen wright: 19:22:40

we also want to let language do the work

stephen wright: 19:22:51

rather than working language

BASEKAMP team: 19:23:30

so we have another question here -- it's sort f been addressed, but probably not fully

ariane.d.: 19:23:35

i believe that gestures could be more « puissants»

BASEKAMP team: 19:24:30

Stephen & Mabel, can you describe in a few sentanceswhat "decreative methodologies" are? what you mean by that? or can you only describe them through example proposals, liek the ones you pasted farther above?

BASEKAMP team: 19:25:03

Eric we'd answer your call, but the audio has been so horrible the last 20 mins or so

ariane.d.: 19:25:06

I believe thet language is and will always be a tool of manipulation and control

stephen wright: 19:25:26

Well, I would be hesitant to give a meta-definition of what they are

siu king chung: 19:25:27

Yes, I am waitng for some examples too

eric_letourneau: 19:25:40

ok i cannot heau you at all at this point

eric_letourneau: 19:25:51

the connection is problematic here in MAdrid

stephen wright: 19:25:55

there's no audio

stephen wright: 19:26:01

only text

BASEKAMP team: 19:26:02

Eric, we intentionally stoppe dthe audio in lieu of the text

eric_letourneau: 19:26:05

i see

stephen wright: 19:26:05

we decreated the audio

eric_letourneau: 19:26:10

BASEKAMP team: 19:26:19

haha

eric_letourneau: 19:26:22

lovely

stephen wright: 19:26:47

but they are something like this:

stephen wright: 19:27:45

they both undo and redo, and in our case they do so by doing what our colleague François Deck calls the mutualising of incompetencies and competencies

stephen wright: 19:28:25

the mutualisation of incompetencies is one example of the decreative in action, because it is premised on the equivalency of the incompetent and the competent

stephen wright: 19:28:57

His collegial moment is founded on how to mutualise incompetencies

siu king chung: 19:29:27

Ha, if stephen says, for example, "we decreated the audio", it seems to mean we adapt to the situation... is that then, decreative is being adaptive?

anthony sawrey: 19:30:02

Wait. Language also locates things as much as an object locates art. Carfull when you say that ' language is and will always be a tool of manipulation and control' Tyres on a car are also ' tools of manipulation and control' but you still need them. The strangification term i used before is placed here to signal methods that can be evoked to short circuit the usual pattern that  we occupy when we think and talk.

stephen wright: 19:30:09

Well, that was more off the cuff admittedly, but somethings things become more powerful in their absence.

stephen wright: 19:31:10

But of course the decreative is moment specific

Randall Szott: 19:31:16

decreation always faces the phantom limb

stephen wright: 19:31:29

you take the formerly creative and repurpose it

mabel: 19:31:35

bur decreative in not exactly being adaptative but it's also to proposes other mode d'opération

mabel: 19:31:55

colegiality is a decreative mode, par exemple

stephen wright: 19:32:12

I sort of think that the decreative is both de- and re-

stephen wright: 19:32:19

Could you expand on that Mabel?

ariane.d.: 19:32:34

what do you mean when you say mode d'opération?

mabel: 19:32:52

"ways of"

ariane.d.: 19:33:02

oui je comprends

ariane.d.: 19:33:18

what does it mean?

ariane.d.: 19:33:50

this is such an artist language

stephen wright: 19:33:59

collegiality is decreative because it is a form of mutualisation of (in)competencies

mabel: 19:34:06

yes

mabel: 19:34:09

that is

siu king chung: 19:34:56

what is mutualisation of (in)competences?

stephen wright: 19:35:07

Here is the definition of that collegial moment:

stephen wright: 19:35:10

Si la valeur culmine dans ce qui est sans équivalent, la convertibilité d’un bien signifie une valeur moindre. Ces biens de nature inférieure sont obtenus par la propagation de l’idée de résultat. L’émergence de richesses uniques implique au contraire un retard concerté des solutions. Dans cette optique, la mutualisation des compétences et des incompétences propose une dilatation des temps.

stephen wright: 19:35:17

Translation coming right up!

stephen wright: 19:35:56

If value culminates from what is without equivalency, goods and services can only be converted at a loss.

stephen wright: 19:36:24

The lesser valued goods are obtained through the propagation of  the idea of a result.

stephen wright: 19:36:51

The emergence of unique forms of wealth implies on the contrary a concerted slowing down of solutions.

eric_letourneau: 19:37:01

This quote fron Francois is brillant.

stephen wright: 19:37:10

In this respect, the mutlaisation of competences and incompetencies offers a dilation of time.

stephen wright: 19:37:30

Yes it's the very essence of the decreative -- whether he agrees with that or not!!

mabel: 19:37:45

you are right, stephen

stephen wright: 19:38:12

So, one sees too the link between the decreative, active sloth and mutualising (in)competencies

siu king chung: 19:38:22

It just occurs to me that being decreative is to ask the most fundamental questions of the meaning of words or lexicons you are now using

stephen wright: 19:38:42

It is not "result" based (unlike neoliberal calculation)

stephen wright: 19:38:49

it slows things way down

stephen wright: 19:39:00

King, you're right -- but this goes beyond words

stephen wright: 19:39:16

If you talk to me, you get the words thing (that's my field in a sense)

stephen wright: 19:39:40

But it is about revaluing value altogether, not only lexical or verbal value

ariane.d.: 19:40:26

life values?

stephen wright: 19:40:31

In that way, it is Nietzschean

ariane.d.: 19:40:33

love values?

Randall Szott: 19:40:41

*value* is what capitalism and socialism leave unquestioned - their shared assumption

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:40:42

am I still connected?

stephen wright: 19:40:51

Exactly

stephen wright: 19:41:05

There may be other shared assumptions

Randall Szott: 19:41:11

well yes

Randall Szott: 19:41:30

also the relationship between production and value

stephen wright: 19:41:35

but what is all too often unchallenged today is the notion of "symbolic capital"

Randall Szott: 19:41:55

all that is a bit turned on its head in the US consumption based economic model

stephen wright: 19:41:56

as if it were the only form of vlaue; as if "value" were a synonym for "capital" of some kind

ariane.d.: 19:42:12

i dont agree at all, stephen

stephen wright: 19:42:14

That is a debate which we have been involved with recently in our college

stephen wright: 19:44:16

someone instigates a collegial moment, appoints a time and place (or not) and it happens

anthony sawrey: 19:44:26

okay. You have managed to define this thing..is there any action involved? Tangible things that is..

stephen wright: 19:44:27

Well there are collegial moments

stephen wright: 19:44:27

I mean, where users as we call them come together

mabel: 19:44:27

eric told one of those moments

ariane.d.: 19:44:30

who are the users?

stephen wright: 19:44:57

as I said, the moment on "lessons of subtraction" was very active recently

anthony sawrey: 19:45:01

like swarming?

stephen wright: 19:45:09

it was paris-based, open to all

BASEKAMP team: 19:45:17

Are you all interested in connecting with teh paris branch of The Public School as a way of "visibilizing" your proposals?

stephen wright: 19:45:22

no, much more reflective in this case

ariane.d.: 19:45:30

how can you become a "user"?

stephen wright: 19:45:39

by using

stephen wright: 19:45:50

it's not prescriptive

anthony sawrey: 19:45:59

whoops starting fade off into language and abstraction again

mabel: 19:46:04

by participating to one or sevral moments

BASEKAMP team: 19:46:09

^^ http://paris.thepublicschool.org/

mabel: 19:46:11

by proposing one

ariane.d.: 19:46:19

how? I guess you must be inevited

stephen wright: 19:46:42

I think that there are significant differences between the college and the Public School

mabel: 19:47:12

you can be invited and soon you will be able to have all the information on the internet site

BASEKAMP team: 19:47:48

^^ Stephen, i was curious - mainly as a way to put forth the ideas, and let other people know about them. not suggesting that the college & TPS are the same

eric_letourneau: 19:48:12

HEy friends, it is really late right now in MAdrid : I'll have to go

stephen wright: 19:48:20

I know Mabel and Eric have thoughts on the Public School

eric_letourneau: 19:48:27

Looking forward to meet you for real one day

Randall Szott: 19:48:34

but this is a difficult balancing act - the visible/invisible

stephen wright: 19:48:37

bye eric

BASEKAMP team: 19:48:39

Eric -- same here

mabel: 19:48:43

bye

stephen wright: 19:48:48

We are not looking for more visibility

eric_letourneau: 19:48:54

ciao bello & bellas

BASEKAMP team: 19:48:57

will be intereting to hear what Eric has to say about TPS @ some point

BASEKAMP team: 19:49:07

Mabel, care to share your thought on the public school?

eric_letourneau: 19:49:10

TPS?

stephen wright: 19:49:16

The public school

eric_letourneau: 19:49:39

ok

eric_letourneau: 19:49:55

well it is i think really different

BASEKAMP team: 19:49:58

...not to derail this discussion entirely -- but since Stephen said the college is different, then describing that thing that's different may be a way to get at what the college is.. throgh what it isn;t... or something

eric_letourneau: 19:50:19

a school and a collège are two different ways to built and construct (or deconstruct) knowledge

stephen wright: 19:50:24

good points. the question is the type of knowledge we want to decreate, the degree of institutional exodus, the way in which we do it.

eric_letourneau: 19:50:33

they are very dintinct from each other

eric_letourneau: 19:50:57

school is really more strict

eric_letourneau: 19:51:12

hierarchical way top treansmit knowledge

stephen wright: 19:51:30

not school, The Public School!

eric_letourneau: 19:51:31

college is more a sharing of ressources

mabel: 19:51:51

and actually I think that the TPS is not necesarly interested in thinking about how to construct/deconstruct knowledge

eric_letourneau: 19:51:55

well... Public school is still a school

eric_letourneau: 19:52:09

no but they are doing it anyway

eric_letourneau: 19:52:36

but a school obey to a form or coertion by some `higher`power i think

stephen wright: 19:52:37

I entirely agree that "methodologies" is not what interests TPS

eric_letourneau: 19:52:41

whatrever it is public or not

eric_letourneau: 19:53:07

college is - IN THEORY - more free from coertion than a school

mabel: 19:53:39

it seems so

stephen wright: 19:53:54

http://thepublicschool.org/

eric_letourneau: 19:54:15

yes i think Claire went there right?

stephen wright: 19:54:26

we are as interested in how we decreate as in what we decreate

eric_letourneau: 19:54:28

and she was quite dissapointed

stephen wright: 19:54:33

yes

eric_letourneau: 19:54:37

at an opening

Randall Szott: 19:54:39

for U.S. folks - I will be calling people together to continue parallel exploration of these ideas in Vermont, New Mexico, and other locations TBD - message me if you're interested - likely weekend or longer affairs, some rustic, some less so

stephen wright: 19:54:52

when's that?

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:55:19

I lost contact for about 5 mins so I have lost the thread of the discussion

BASEKAMP team: 19:55:20

Randall - great

eric_letourneau: 19:55:47

ok i really leave no

stephen wright: 19:55:57

good night eric!

BASEKAMP team: 19:55:58

well, regarding TPS, because it *is* open, anyone can propose a class about anything. So one course may be more in line with A college than others

eric_letourneau: 19:56:02

my brain is not useful for anybody right now - including myself

BASEKAMP team: 19:56:03

g'night Eric!

eric_letourneau: 19:56:10

ciao again

BASEKAMP team: 19:56:11

mabel: 19:56:12

good night!!!

ariane.d.: 19:56:18

you are all so ambitous

BASEKAMP team: 19:56:42

^^ ambitious slackers

stephen wright: 19:56:53

in the collège, anyone can instigate a collegial moment too

ariane.d.: 19:56:54

for sure

BASEKAMP team: 19:56:59

Randall -- can you add us to that list of interested US folks?

anthony sawrey: 19:57:08

me too!

BASEKAMP team: 19:57:13

Stephen - cool - can we instigate a collegial moment?

stephen wright: 19:57:32

of course, that would be excellent, the Charter is quite explicit

mabel: 19:57:49

yes, it would be great

mabel: 19:57:51

!!!

stephen wright: 19:57:55

super!

BASEKAMP team: 19:58:59

Stepeh & Mabel -- thank you so much for joining us tonight!

stephen wright: 19:59:13

since it is a college without walls, you don't even need to knock on the door

BASEKAMP team: 19:59:41

heh, right

BASEKAMP team: 19:59:47

or knock down the door

mabel: 20:00:00

yes, that is

stephen wright: 20:00:09

or burning down the school. anyway thank you -- too bad about the audio

BASEKAMP team: 20:00:16

i dont' want to kill the conversation -- but i know it's very late for people in europe --

BASEKAMP team: 20:00:24

yes - indeed!

mabel: 20:00:28

yes!! thank you

Randall Szott: 20:00:32

so good to "talk" with you again stephen

stephen wright: 20:00:36

watch for the website

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:00:44

yes it was great

stephen wright: 20:00:44

hey you too randall!

eandockray" title="seandockray">Sean Dockray: 20:00:46

thanks stephen and mabel sorry to miss the first part

anthony sawrey: 20:00:48

yeah, break dwon the walls!!!

 

stephen wright: 20:00:55

open up the moments

bojana romic: 20:00:56

thanks, bye

mabel: 20:01:05

ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:01:06

at last a serious conversation

Randall Szott: 20:01:17

and maybe you can tell me via email what/if you know about Jean-Yves Jouannais,

BASEKAMP team: 20:01:22

thanks everyone - this has ben really great

stephen wright: 20:01:27

will do

Amanda Hills: 20:01:31

stephen wright: 20:01:43

talk to you all next week

BASEKAMP team: 20:01:44

See you all next week

Amanda Hills: 20:02:13