Backchannel

Chat History with basekamp/$d9403d76ce6a2a19" title="#basekamp/$d9403d76ce6a2a19">House Magic: The European squatted social centers movement http://bit.ly/63xEP7 (#basekamp/$d9403d76ce6a2a19)

Created on 2010-01-20 01:28:44.

BASEKAMP team: 18:09:22: Hi everyone
Aharon: 18:09:24: hiyas!
Aharon: 18:09:31: thanks scott
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:10:18: hi
atrowbri: 18:10:40: Art420005: Plausible Artworlds clas is here. We are discussing the history and theory of property/land rights
BASEKAMP team: 18:12:33: so welcome everyone -- we are running a few mins behind, though inching closer to starting at 6PM ]
Jessica Westbrook: 18:13:02: hi hi hi
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:13:37: hey y'all
Greg Scranton: 18:13:49: hey everyone welcome and thx for coming
magdalenatc: 18:13:51: hello everyone
Greg Scranton: 18:13:55: we'll be getting started soon
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:14:00: ok no problem just need to drink afew cups of coffee
Greg Scranton: 18:14:18: jessicawestbrook!!!!!!!!!
Jessica Westbrook: 18:14:24: hi greg : )
magdalenatc: 18:14:25: hello david, haven't seen you for centuries i think nice to see you
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:14:36: same here
Greg Scranton: 18:14:50: how is everything in TN? You in class with Adam?
Jessica Westbrook: 18:14:56: gewd
Jessica Westbrook: 18:15:00: we are here in class
Jessica Westbrook: 18:15:05: yes
atrowbri: 18:15:25: The whole class is here
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:15:42: that's an awesome turnout
Greg Scranton: 18:15:49: we are eating munchkins thx to michael's parents who are joining us 2nite
BASEKAMP team: 18:16:08: so who wants to be on audio?
Greg Scranton: 18:16:18: Adam you ready to start audio?
atrowbri: 18:16:59: we are
atrowbri: 18:17:13: We are discussing whether there is a nearby dunkin donuts
magdalenatc: 18:17:13: i am too
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:17:18: yes please
BASEKAMP team: 18:17:38: hi Stephen
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:17:46: yes
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:18:04: that was yes to audio
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:18:14: and hi stephen
stephen wright: 18:19:18: hello!
BASEKAMP team: 18:19:37: let's start the call, then we'll get sarted chatting in a moment
BASEKAMP team: 18:20:04: stephen, can you turn your skype status on
BASEKAMP team: 18:20:47: hi Ally --
BASEKAMP team: 18:20:56: alliy i mean
Alliy Reynolds: 18:21:28: ha. no prob. hi!
BASEKAMP team: 18:22:14: who wants to call?
atrowbri: 18:22:24: <------
atrowbri: 18:23:00: ME
Jessica Westbrook: 18:23:02: can you call atrowbri
Greg Scranton: 18:23:12: Alliy we'll add you shortly
Jessica Westbrook: 18:23:13: his machine is set on a speaker
Aharon: 18:24:13: who is hosting the chat..?
Greg Scranton: 18:24:29: basekamp is hosting, hang tight everyone
Greg Scranton: 18:24:37: we're getting started here shortly
stephen wright: 18:24:52: who just called me?
Aharon: 18:24:56: ok.. it appeared here as if ally was hosting
Greg Scranton: 18:25:00: Alan is here in the space and we're introducing him here quickly
BASEKAMP team: 18:25:08: starting the call now
Aharon: 18:25:35: its not calling
atrowbri: 18:25:43
Jessica Westbrook: 18:25:51
atrowbri: 18:26:01
Greg Scranton: 18:26:31: eww jessica eww
atrowbri: 18:26:45
Greg Scranton: 18:27:20: just a friendly reminder that it works best if you mute your mics until you are ready to talk, yes thx Aharon perfect!
magdalenatc: 18:28:42: are you on audio now? have i missed something?
atrowbri: 18:29:25: It might be good to note when the call starts.
Jessica Westbrook: 18:29:36: hello william
Jessica Westbrook: 18:29:53: audio status?
WCulpepper: 18:30:18: Helllo everyone
BASEKAMP team: 18:30:41: adding you now atrowbri
BASEKAMP team: 18:30:56: ading you now magda
Aharon: 18:31:13: lost sound
BASEKAMP team: 18:31:16: back
Aharon: 18:31:18: oh
Aharon: 18:31:23: bk
BASEKAMP team: 18:31:26: who else are we missing?
atrowbri: 18:31:32: ME
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:31:36: me
BASEKAMP team: 18:31:40: should we keep trying atrowbri?
magdalenatc: 18:31:41: thank you i am in
atrowbri: 18:31:50: I havent gotten a single call
BASEKAMP team: 18:31:55
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:08: adam calling you now
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:14: do you see?
atrowbri: 18:32:16: nope
atrowbri: 18:32:21: NOTHIGN
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:31: hrm
Jessica Westbrook: 18:32:38: use mine then
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:39: can we try jessica?
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:40: ok
Jessica Westbrook: 18:32:43: teleSEED
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:49: calling teleSEED
BASEKAMP team: 18:32:57: yay
Jessica Westbrook: 18:33:53: we are set here
BASEKAMP team: 18:33:59: trying you again
BASEKAMP team: 18:34:14: oh - i see. ok
Jessica Westbrook: 18:34:22
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:34:35
BASEKAMP team: 18:34:43
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:35:25: i'm still not in
BASEKAMP team: 18:35:59: WCulpepper - we'll add you
BASEKAMP team: 18:36:06: stepahinie ok
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:36:16: thx
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:36:33: whoops
WCulpepper: 18:36:43: copy, new here...
BASEKAMP team: 18:37:18: david g - you lost audio? want us to call u back?
atrowbri: 18:37:57: the noise is intense, can the mic be isolated?
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:37:58: yes I have lost audio
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:38:32: do you mean my mic should be isolated?
atrowbri: 18:38:51: No, basekamp is just noise with a few voices
BASEKAMP team: 18:39:21: ok , so we have 10 locations on the audio call -- not too bad
atrowbri: 18:39:27: the hammering and moving and slammig
atrowbri: 18:39:33: it's all basekamp noise
BASEKAMP team: 18:39:42: yeah, we are noisy here
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 18:39:50: yes i hear the hammering, slamming too
Alliy Reynolds: 18:39:50: :
atrowbri: 18:40:01: need an isolated mic
WCulpepper: 18:40:05: The ship is at sea
atrowbri: 18:40:12: this is not really worth listening for the class
BASEKAMP team: 18:40:18
BASEKAMP team: 18:40:25: oh really?
Alliy Reynolds: 18:40:34: eh. it's okay. just listen to the man.
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:40:35: fantastic
BASEKAMP team: 18:40:43: adam, what is the biggest noise problem? kung fu?
BASEKAMP team: 18:40:46: typing?
atrowbri: 18:42:43: it's gotten better, it wasnt the kung fu, it's movement in the bk space
BASEKAMP team: 18:42:44: please everyone mute your audio when not speaking
BASEKAMP team: 18:42:52: though feel free to speak!
BASEKAMP team: 18:42:57: ok adam, thanks
BASEKAMP team: 18:43:09: tell us if it gets bad... we'll do what we can to keep noise low
Aharon: 18:44:46: well... in copenhagen, i visited tv-tv who are housed in a sqt building. however, they, tv-tv do also get funds from the state.. so on one side of the building, it is all fenced, because police come knocking at times - on the other hand, in the bank, they have money from the state..
Jessica Westbrook: 18:46:00: sounds much better
BASEKAMP team: 18:46:06
Aharon: 18:46:13: better than what?
Jessica Westbrook: 18:46:32: we were getting a lot of brushing sound
BASEKAMP team: 18:46:33: ok aharon - we can bing that up if you'd like? ALan hasnt seen teh text -- or you can speak yourself if you prefer?
BASEKAMP team: 18:46:50: kung fu? or typing?
BASEKAMP team: 18:46:56: i ask because i can stop typing
Aharon: 18:46:58: just a note
Aharon: 18:47:04
BASEKAMP team: 18:48:53
stephen wright: 18:50:27: please call me back
Alliy Reynolds: 18:50:57: Do you think at some point we can get a little more of a bio on Alan Moore? Personal experience? How he started the House Magic: Bureau of Foreign Correspondence?
Greg Scranton: 18:51:40: hang on stephen I'm on it
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:52:17: Is it possible to have the questions typed out?
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:52:32: its not so easy to hear them from here
Greg Scranton: 18:52:36: we'll work on the ?s
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:52:44: ok
Greg Scranton: 18:52:56: text or we'll ask Alan to say them aloud before answering
Greg Scranton: 18:53:51: current ? was about the nature of the show as being a "suitcase exhibition"
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:54:01: yes
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:54:03: thanks
Greg Scranton: 18:54:12: sure
Aharon: 18:54:44: it is an interesting observation you made, re dutch cultural relationship with sqts. however, is it not that very example that shows the regulatory function of such activities - rather than a radical function that indeed challanges the status-quo..? (..a bit like fighting to gain acceptance within a given system, to be tolerated - rather than offering a different mode and arguing for equality..)
BASEKAMP team: 18:56:29: can you all hear that question?
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:56:38: no
Greg Scranton: 18:56:39: again a follow up to nature of the show travelling around city to city
stephen wright: 18:56:44: what question?
stephen wright: 18:57:04: i can't hear scott
BASEKAMP team: 18:57:28: that's because i'm sitting right next to teh mic
BASEKAMP team: 18:57:48: can you hear henken better now?
stephen wright: 18:57:56: yes
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 18:57:59: yes
BASEKAMP team: 18:58:06: oh - "can't hear scott" -
BASEKAMP team: 18:58:25: mumbles ...
BASEKAMP team: 18:58:58: aharon had a question above though...
atrowbri: 19:00:21: Question: Can you talk a little more about positive tactics, making the commune work before the tanks arrive, so to speak. Avoiding the police arriving at all?
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 19:03:05: can you call me again?
BASEKAMP team: 19:03:09: y
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 19:03:09: disconnected
Aharon: 19:03:18: capitalism is against state as well..
BASEKAMP team: 19:03:23: adding ou stephanie
BASEKAMP team: 19:04:17: please mute your mic till you'd like to speak (feel free to speak though!) -- thanks
Greg Scranton: 19:05:30: can everyone mute mic unless talking, thx
BASEKAMP team: 19:05:34: (mute button on your call window)
BASEKAMP team: 19:05:46: we are hypocritical of course, not muting ours
BASEKAMP team: 19:05:57: but we have to keep it on, since Alan is here in person this week
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:06:05: cant here the question
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:06:11: hear
Greg Scranton: 19:06:14: ? is about the nature of NYC
Greg Scranton: 19:06:31: NYC as center of capitalism
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:06:52: and whose asking the question?
Greg Scranton: 19:07:03: and how squats have been crushed by authorities etc
stephen wright: 19:07:57: Alan, I have a question regarding how you see this movement tying into plausible artworlds. Squatting is something of a typology of an artworld -- use the existing but under-used housing opportunities for your otherwise homeless project. The house of art is free and is everywhere to be squatted. Let me give an example. In Martha Rosler's "If you lived here..." project on homelessness, a quote by Peter Marcuse was written on the wall: "Homelessness exists not because the housing system doesn't work but because this is how it works." Well, one might replace the word homelessness by "squattership". Or, one might add the genetive "art" to homelessness and replace "housing system" by art system, giving: "Art's homelessness -- squatting -- exists not becuase the art system doesn't work but becuase this is how it works. Anyway... just a thought... but how to do you see the squatting model -- an epiphetic rather than a parasitical model - as a plausible artworld?
Greg Scranton: 19:08:50: you're next stephen
stephen wright: 19:10:42: I can't hear anything
atrowbri: 19:10:52: insane noise
Greg Scranton: 19:10:55: any better?
atrowbri: 19:10:59: yes
stephen wright: 19:11:07: marginally
BASEKAMP team: 19:11:23: yeah - that's bkamp
BASEKAMP team: 19:11:34: "insane noise"
Aharon: 19:18:30: homelessness at that time, well.. beginning of 90's was rather hip.. recall that song..?? dadadi-dadada..?
BASEKAMP team: 19:21:10: no counter-culture in france --- except for the riots stephen, wouldn't you say?
BASEKAMP team: 19:22:00
Aharon: 19:22:48: it can be argued that he was institutionalised - not nescsart RA..
Aharon: 19:23:08: though i agree that RA is a very weak theory
BASEKAMP team: 19:24:51: Also, i'm curious if anyone here knows anythign about squattign in Philadelphia?
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:25:11: not a thing
BASEKAMP team: 19:25:40
Amanda Hills: 19:26:25: Like Broadway squats ..in Sydney up to the 2000 olympics...the high profile of these spaces which were highly associated with independant art movements of the time allowing them to survive longer .. The art activist angle coupled with the sensitivity of the state goverment and Sydney city council in the games year to not appear heavy handed in a official response, allowed these spaces a greater oppurtunity to integrate into the community through art which was not usually the case with squatted social spaces previously therfore making them more resistant to immediate eviction....
Aharon: 19:27:11: in terms of "cultural centres" - would you say that in a sense, if one looks at religions as artworlds, such attempts at setting cultural centres and indeed, as you mentioned before "embedding within communities", is all too similar to the way religious people work within society?
atrowbri: 19:29:08: cannot understand scott
Aharon: 19:30:08: also, another question in relation to art, there are squats that set themselves for very limited period for the very aim of putting up a show/festival/gig - and then leave the place. at times, the powers that be let these things happen because they know it is "only temporary"..
BASEKAMP team: 19:30:14: i asked about squats in philadelphia
BASEKAMP team: 19:30:27: can you hear albo jeavons?
atrowbri: 19:30:41: no knowledge of squatting in chattanooga beyond homelessness
BASEKAMP team: 19:30:57: aharon & amanda, we will get to your comments too jsut wanted to address the local here for a bit
atrowbri: 19:33:09: "Squatters settled on land all over Cherokee Nation. This was strictly illegal and the goverment attempted to protect the Cherokee's legal rights to the land. A squatter could legalize his claim by marrying a Cherokee--or leave the territory. There was a sudden upswing in marriages between whites and Cherokee. Then John C. Calhoun, Secretary of War, ordered Andrew Jackson to march from Chattanooga to Augusta to remove squatters from Cherokee land."
BASEKAMP team: 19:33:18: alex is asking if squatters can get services like electricity & water in london
Aharon: 19:34:08: they can.. if they can get ito the electric/water system..
BASEKAMP team: 19:36:15: alex is asking whether or not there are places where people can stil squat in philly
Amanda Hills: 19:37:02: religious people link with communites via a number of avenues, they can then move in a community on a number of differnent levels so yes, squatting acitvist groups who are articized as well as politicized alter the algotrithim that authority is familiar with in that moment. It can create breathing spaces to give time for new things to happen..
BASEKAMP team: 19:37:27: chris has a real estate liscence, and is talkign about pennsylvania law - if you occupy a space for 25+ years then you qualify for "adverse possession" and can claim ownership
atrowbri: 19:37:34: [QUESTION] Alan: How would you see the relationship between a successful squat and gentrification, wouldn't a successful squat automatically become a tool of recuperation via gentrification?
BASEKAMP team: 19:38:25: btw, did you all ehar amanda's comment
BASEKAMP team: 19:38:27: ?
BASEKAMP team: 19:38:30: hear?
BASEKAMP team: 19:38:56: "angela" oops
Amanda Hills: 19:39:30: thanks for the oppurtunity to listen in on this chat...very interesting.. gotta go and have a late breakfast now then go sit on a beach.....cheerio
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:43:16: gentrification is not necessarily the problem, the problem is whether there have the resources made available for people/artists who dont have the resources or money to exist under the conditions that they need - which is something the Dutch have tried to resolve
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:43:38: they have the resources..meant to say
atrowbri: 19:44:18: post-autonomy: anywhere we can take a look at those potential solutions?
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:44:34: I think the recourse to Roslers formula of gentirication is quite lazy
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:44:55: I can find out for you
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:44:59: if you wish
atrowbri: 19:45:25: there is a discussion page for each event you can post it to
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 19:45:34: ok
atrowbri: 19:45:49: http://basekamp.com/about/events/house-magic-european-squatted-social-ce... comments, at the end of the page
Greg Scranton: 19:46:35: organization of activities at social centers?
Greg Scranton: 19:46:50: the question was (above)
Greg Scranton: 19:48:17: some photos from this evenings chat http://www.flickr.com/photos/basekamp2010/sets/72157623120748615/
BASEKAMP team: 19:50:16: can you all hear Henken?
atrowbri: 19:50:22: ye
atrowbri: 19:50:26: s
BASEKAMP team: 19:50:31
magdalenatc: 19:51:32: i wanted to ask a question about the project Magic House as research and about this collection of various squatting situations that you have gatehred. they are all very interesting and useful, but I wanted to ask about your udnerpinning question that you might be working on and that researching those projects help in answering? perhaps you mentioned that already...?
Greg Scranton: 19:52:14: magda we'll get you in the queue
BASEKAMP team: 19:52:14: someone mentioning the homesteading movement here
magdalenatc: 19:52:55: can you just read out my question whenever time comes...
Greg Scranton: 19:53:11: yes magda
magdalenatc: 19:53:20: thank you
Greg Scranton: 19:54:16: of course
Aharon: 19:55:34: maybe its a plausible gentrification artwirld..
magdalenatc: 19:55:34: thanks fo rthe photos
stephen wright: 19:56:24: oops. I'm disconnected
BASEKAMP team: 19:56:39: connecting you
stephen wright: 19:56:44: thanx
BASEKAMP team: 19:56:57: ben has a comment about a superfund site --- can you hear?
BASEKAMP team: 19:57:01: (then magda)
magdalenatc: 19:59:32: that's great answer!!! thanks
Aharon: 19:59:57: who is the other alana moore..???
Aharon: 20:00:32: oh
Aharon: 20:00:33: i c
Aharon: 20:00:36: lol
stephen wright: 20:00:51: Super talk Alan, thanks a lot! (Btw, there's another Stephen Wright too -- he's a serial killer though.)
Greg Scranton: 20:00:53: Public School....
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:00:55: I have lost contact
Greg Scranton: 20:01:14: p-a we're on it
Aharon: 20:01:26: thanks alan!
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:01:30: thanks
tephanietate1209" title="stephanietate1209">stephanietate1209: 20:01:35: thanks
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:01:45: yes very interesting
BASEKAMP team: 20:03:56: http://www.basekamp.com/about/events/house-magic-european-squatted-socia...
stephen wright: 20:03:58: THe whole squatting scene in South America is really interesting (esp. Brazil and Argentina) and would be surely interested in finding out more about all this stuff.
BASEKAMP team: 20:04:00: http://www.basekamp.com/about/events/house-magic-european-squatted-socia...
Greg Scranton: 20:04:47: Alan will provide some links to online resources
stephen wright: 20:05:12: excellent
magdalenatc: 20:05:34: thank yp
Greg Scranton: 20:05:35: thanks everyone for coming
Alliy Reynolds: 20:05:35: *clap clap clap*
magdalenatc: 20:05:39: you
BASEKAMP team: 20:05:44: goodnight everyone
Alliy Reynolds: 20:05:51: thanks guys!
stephen wright: 20:05:53: see you next week
Greg Scranton: 20:05:55: feel free to lurk as well
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:06:04: thank you and look forward to joining you again soon
Greg Scranton: 20:09:11: nite all
ost-autonomy" title="post-autonomy">post-autonomy: 20:09:46: good night and thank you for a very thought provoking debate